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Racism in football

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 1:29pm
Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

Apologists for Suarez say that he was only using language acceptable at home in Uraguay. The Times sums this up perfectly:

"Suarez maintained that the word negrito, which he admitted calling Evra on a number of occasions, is a strictly neutral term which is widely used at home in Uraguay. Quite why, in the course of an evidently heated argument, Suarez felt the need to point out the colour of Evra's skin, he was unable to explain".


spot on. i think liverpool fc are being badly advised at the moment. those t shirts they warmed up in were not a good idea
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 1:36pm
Originally posted by rap columbo rap columbo wrote:

Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:

that's it SA14. I'm calling the police as you are being racist to the Cornish..

perhaps any welshman called Taffy by the english should also call the police or scotsmen called Jock....

very ropey ground....

Doc, Suarez played last year for Ajax with one of the largest compliment of black people in the league...
ron atkinson bought black players, too
I'd say the Big Ron issue was more of a stupid generational thing as opposed to genuine bigotry, Ron saw nothing wrong with the word as just an insult, though ignorance is no excuse. Cyrille Regis has plenty of praise for him in his autobiography, but Ron's reputation took a massive hammering, which considering what he did to further the cause of black footballers in the 70's is a shame. I personally was gutted when he said it, as he was in charge when I first saw the side which included Regis/Moses and Cunnnigham.
 
Suarez on the other hand used the word "Negrito" ("little black man" I believe), which he states can be used in an affectionate way, which I doubt it was in the middle of a bust up with Evra. He pleaded ignorance which in this day and age doesn't wash with me, he's been in Europe long enough to know the differences.
I'd comment more on Terry if I knew what he said but the media have scrambled it, one report said he was retorting to Ferdinand saying "I didn't call you a ##### #######". In both cases I find it hard to believe there is full on racism, as surely it would have risen it's ugly head before now as they both play in multi-racial sides as well as against similar teams?
 
No room for it in society, let alone sport. Although it doesn't do any harm educating people as bigoted comments have been known to appear on this very forum, and if the people responsible want to moan then i'm sure the topics can be referenced.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote salmidach Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 3:54pm
big differences here...

Ron Atkinson - Stupid black B*****d
John Terry - (allegedly) Black C***
Suarez - Negrito....

now the word Neger is used throughout europe as a a Neutral term for black people...

the point is where do we draw the line. the word N****r which I find highly offensive as it is a slang word. Neger is commonly used in Holland and Germany...
They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance - Terry Pratchett
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote John_Radio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 4:10pm
Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:


now the word Neger is used throughout europe as a a Neutral term for black people...

 
'alfwits!
Pint for John?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SA14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 5:58pm
Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:

this is also quite alarming

Alan Hansen is in hot water for saying the word coloured on Match of the Day last night...

Are you saying that word or quoting it? This could lead to the return of Regan's love child and a ban for you. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Abbey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 6:53pm
Originally posted by John_Radio John_Radio wrote:

Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:




now the word Neger is used throughout europe as a a Neutral term for black people...



 

'alfwits!


Funnily enough, I'm currently reading a book on the moon landings and in setting the scene for life in the 1960s, it says that at that time Americans were still using the term Negro which showed how "backward" race relations were.

I thought that was a long time ago.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote haydn_davies Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 7:16pm
The difference I've been told between John Terry's case and Luis Suarez's incident is that no-one (i'm lead to believe) overheard what Suarez said to Evra.  On the other hand people DID hear what Terry said to Ferdinand - and there is video footage of the incident to back up the charge against him.
 
If Suarez is guilty and banned for 8 matches on the evidence of the person accusing him, what the hell is going to happen to John Terry??  Banned for a season?? Confused
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote maldwyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 7:17pm
Can't make my mind up which one I dislike most the racist  the footballer or the football fan.
Up the bum no harm done.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SMELLYMIKE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 7:29pm
Cmon guy ..people are suffering , the worlds ecconomy is in pieces and people are being lest homeless and we are talking about a bunch of over paid [beep]s...get a grip they are a bunch of inbred c**** who deserve f*** all
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr_martinov Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 7:48pm
Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:

big differences here...

Ron Atkinson - Stupid black B*****d
John Terry - (allegedly) Black C***
Suarez - Negrito....

now the word Neger is used throughout europe as a a Neutral term for black people...

the point is where do we draw the line. the word N****r which I find highly offensive as it is a slang word. Neger is commonly used in Holland and Germany...

Context is everything. "Black" is [currently] a non-racist term. "Stupid" and "Bastard" are non-racist, but offensive, terms. But calling someone a "stupid black bastard", however, is abusing someone specifically because of their race, i.e. that is racist. So if you are specifically referencing somebody's race in an offensive manner, you are liable to have that deemed as racially offensive.

Therefore, what Suarez said in and arounds the word "negrito" are key to this whole debate (the "...." in your post). If he was being abusive towards Evra and included a word defining the colour of Evra's skin as part of this, that would be deemed as racial abuse, as per the above example. He has been found guilty of this and disciplined.  As you say, and this should be the main point of this IMO, it is still only Evra's word against Suarez's here, which is presumably the point the Liverpool players were trying to make.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote A Evans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 7:51pm
Originally posted by haydn_davies haydn_davies wrote:

The difference I've been told between John Terry's case and Luis Suarez's incident is that no-one (i'm lead to believe) overheard what Suarez said to Evra.  On the other hand people DID hear what Terry said to Ferdinand - and there is video footage of the incident to back up the charge against him.
 
If Suarez is guilty and banned for 8 matches on the evidence of the person accusing him, what the hell is going to happen to John Terry??  Banned for a season?? Confused
Suarez has admitted he used the term. Now it may not mean anything in his country but he is not in his country. He may actually not be racist (i dont know him so i cant comment) but he has been found guilty of using "insulting words in reference to Manchester United defender Evra's colour". Are we saying this is acceptable? (not directed at you Haydn just a general question).
We are Con Air. You will be assimilated. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SMELLYMIKE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 December 2011 at 8:19pm
You guys all need to get things in perspective 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertaf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 December 2011 at 9:57am
Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

The support shown last night for Suarez has baffled me. Is it really that honourable for players to wear t-shirts in support of a colleague found guilty of racism? If any of my colleagues uttered any kind of racist remark I would make sure they were sacked and not show unstinting support.

Terry, on the other hand, may be innocent - the truth will out in due course. But most professionals would find themselves suspended on full pay if they were on such a charge (think teachers, police etc). All the press seem to care about is whether he should continue as England captain.

Racism is one of the most abhorrent things a society can tollerate - whatever form it takes or to whoever it is directed at. I think football writers and players have lost sight of that fact.

Feel free to disagree, but I WILL judge you (ha ha!!)


The way I see it is that Liverpool clearly disagree with the ruling hence the support. The facts of the case make the suspension ridiculous, the only person who heard the alleged abuse was Evra - no other player heard anything ! For them to rule based on one's person's testimony is bizarre. Don't get me wrong I don't condone racism but I am a Lierpool fan if that isn't obvious LOL


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 December 2011 at 7:11pm
so it's ok because only one person heard it?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertaf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 December 2011 at 10:20pm
Originally posted by rap columbo rap columbo wrote:

so it's ok because only one person heard it?
Miss the point Rap, how can a judge rule on something that no one heard except the person making the complaint? If I accused you of racism against me in the street if I was black, would you expect to get banged up if only you and I were party to the alleged incident?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertaf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 December 2011 at 10:24pm
Originally posted by haydn_davies haydn_davies wrote:

The difference I've been told between John Terry's case and Luis Suarez's incident is that no-one (i'm lead to believe) overheard what Suarez said to Evra.  On the other hand people DID hear what Terry said to Ferdinand - and there is video footage of the incident to back up the charge against him.
 
If Suarez is guilty and banned for 8 matches on the evidence of the person accusing him, what the hell is going to happen to John Terry??  Banned for a season?? Confused
Bet he won't be though despite the facts as you state them. The fact that Suarez doesn't even deny using a word that he doesn't feel is racist surely says a lot about the case, who openly admits to something that they know will get them banned if they feel that they have done something wrong?
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