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Albert View Drop Down
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Points: 932 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Albert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 February 2012 at 9:32pm
Originally posted by M.M. M.M. wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Originally posted by haydn_davies haydn_davies wrote:

Compare the Dragons with the Scarlets though.

We get roughly double their average gate.

We also provide twice as much if not three times the amount of players to Wales than they do.

Would it be fair then that the Dragons get say 30-40% of what we'd get from the WRU?

Don't get me wrong, from a Scarlets point of view it would be great, but not so great if your a Dragons fan!!
 
Maybe the Dragons should start properly developing their young players then rather than signing journeymen and trying to poach the best academy graduates produced by the other three regions every summer.
 
Apart from maybe 3 seasons when Tony Brown funded Newport, Gwent rugby has been dire for the last 30 years.
It has consistently failed to be competative and, since 2003, Dragons have been the real under -achievers in europe. (The other 3 not being brilliant either). That does not look like changing this season.
 
There is a real problem in Gwent. I see no sign of it being addressed at all.
 
 
There is no question that top tier rugby in Gwent/Momouthshire has been suffering from a malaise for too many years. The politics and the divisions there has certainly not helped to create a healthy and vibrant game in that part of the country. As an outsider, I wouldn't know where to begin to pass comment on the sad state of affairs at Newport Gwent Dragons . However, I would be very surprised if cutting their central funding, and splitting the savings ( not necessarily in equal portions ) between the other three would contribute in any way to finding a solution to the problem. I believe it would simply further hasten the demise of professional rugby in those parts, without really strengthening in it in Wales as a whole. There are serious marketing issues to be addressed by all the regions and the WRU.  On it's own, making the Dragons a development team for the other three is barking up the wrong tree; it will simply further alienate and disenfranchise one of the biggest rugby areas. In short, I think it would be disastrous.

Edited by Albert - 07 February 2012 at 9:48pm
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Abbey View Drop Down
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Originally posted by TonduTurk TonduTurk wrote:

Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

The WRU do have some history of this. I remember when the Warriors were divvied up, we were the standard bearers in Europe so it was suggested we get last pick of the players. We ended up with just Smiler and Havilli.



i dont remember that, i remember all the players being up for grabs, and we had a settled squad that had just won the league so only needed a few players.


The Warriors players were distributed under a draught system where the most unsuccessful region got first dibbs.

The nearest quote I have is from the BBC at the time which wrote:

"Some 20 players of the 34-man squad were called one-by-one to learn their fate, having heard this week that the WRU plan to disband the regional side.

The distribution will probably be based on a draft system, players agent Adam Palfrey told BBC Wales.

Cardiff Blues are thought likely to get first pick as the least successful side last season."

So the WRU have form for this kind of "weakest needs the most help" ideology.
If I remember rightly, the player we most wanted was Ryan Jones but it was suggested that to allow the Scarlets to grab the best players would only make us stronger at the expense of the other regions.

The other quote which shows huge irony in hindsight is:

"The Ospreys have also offered their assistance and "will move heaven and earth to bring in as much of the Warriors' region within the Ospreys set-up"."

Set the tone for the next 7 years. I love the "offered their assistance" bit!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/3725539.stm





Edited by Abbey - 07 February 2012 at 10:33pm
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roy munster View Drop Down
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Points: 1726 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 February 2012 at 11:20pm
very poor that no region other than scarlets choose to participate in this documentary. kind of pathetic really. the whole gwent malaise hasnt changed in years and even money doesnt seem to been getting things moving.
 
would it work better if they decided once and for all what their name is for starters?
are they newport or are they gwent or are they dragons?
at least ospreys are ospreys even if it is a dull meaningless name
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Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

Originally posted by TonduTurk TonduTurk wrote:

Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

The WRU do have some history of this. I remember when the Warriors were divvied up, we were the standard bearers in Europe so it was suggested we get last pick of the players. We ended up with just Smiler and Havilli.



i dont remember that, i remember all the players being up for grabs, and we had a settled squad that had just won the league so only needed a few players.


The Warriors players were distributed under a draught system where the most unsuccessful region got first dibbs.

The nearest quote I have is from the BBC at the time which wrote:

"Some 20 players of the 34-man squad were called one-by-one to learn their fate, having heard this week that the WRU plan to disband the regional side.

The distribution will probably be based on a draft system, players agent Adam Palfrey told BBC Wales.

Cardiff Blues are thought likely to get first pick as the least successful side last season."

So the WRU have form for this kind of "weakest needs the most help" ideology.

If I remember rightly, the player we most wanted was Ryan Jones but it was suggested that to allow the Scarlets to grab the best players would only make us stronger at the expense of the other regions.

The other quote which shows huge irony in hindsight is:

"The Ospreys have also offered their assistance and "will move heaven and earth to bring in as much of the Warriors' region within the Ospreys set-up"."

Set the tone for the next 7 years. I love the "offered their assistance" bit!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/3725539.stm



the bit in bold is a statement, and all you've got to back it up is "nearest quote", "probably", "thought likely", "If I remember rightly" and "suggested".
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Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

very poor that no region other than scarlets choose to participate in this documentary. kind of pathetic really. the whole gwent malaise hasnt changed in years and even money doesnt seem to been getting things moving.
 
would it work better if they decided once and for all what their name is for starters?
are they newport or are they gwent or are they dragons?
at least ospreys are ospreys even if it is a dull meaningless name

SG represented the Welsh Regions.
Life is not a rehearsal, make sure you support the Scarlets NOW
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roy munster View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Vulcan Vulcan wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

very poor that no region other than scarlets choose to participate in this documentary. kind of pathetic really. the whole gwent malaise hasnt changed in years and even money doesnt seem to been getting things moving.
 
would it work better if they decided once and for all what their name is for starters?
are they newport or are they gwent or are they dragons?
at least ospreys are ospreys even if it is a dull meaningless name

SG represented the Welsh Regions.
yeah but not one employee at ospreys or dragons had any input into the show. very disappointing. maybe its siege mentality at th emoment
ROYMOND MUNTER MBE (FOR SERVICES TO THE COMBOVER)
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Vulcan View Drop Down
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Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Originally posted by Vulcan Vulcan wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

very poor that no region other than scarlets choose to participate in this documentary. kind of pathetic really. the whole gwent malaise hasnt changed in years and even money doesnt seem to been getting things moving.
 
would it work better if they decided once and for all what their name is for starters?
are they newport or are they gwent or are they dragons?
at least ospreys are ospreys even if it is a dull meaningless name

SG represented the Welsh Regions.
yeah but not one employee at ospreys or dragons had any input into the show. very disappointing. maybe its siege mentality at th emoment

Except Roger BlythWink
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haydn_davies View Drop Down
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Points: 5763 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote haydn_davies Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 February 2012 at 11:57pm
Originally posted by Vulcan Vulcan wrote:


Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

very poor that no region other than scarlets choose to participate in this documentary. kind of pathetic really. the whole gwent malaise hasnt changed in years and even money doesnt seem to been getting things moving.
 

would it work better if they decided once and for all what their name is for starters?

are they newport or are they gwent or are they dragons?

at least ospreys are ospreys even if it is a dull meaningless name


SG represented the Welsh Regions.

But he was sitting at Parc y Scarlets being interviewed and mentioned that he wanted his grandchildren to grow up watching George North and Rhys Priestland play here and not abroad!!
Think, think, think - it's a thinking man's game!! - The Great Carwyn James.
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Tim Opolis View Drop Down
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If the WRU decides to have seperate relationships with the regions, what do they think the region that gets short changed is going to do and in particular their benefactors? They might as well just call it the start of the process of going down to 3 regions, because that's where this is going. Finances must be bad!
 
Cant see how seperate relationships is going to work, can someone explain it to me and convince me everyone's going to be happy with it?
Tymor nesa Duw, plis tymor nesa.
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Vulcan View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Tim Opolis Tim Opolis wrote:

If the WRU decides to have seperate relationships with the regions, what do they think the region that gets short changed is going to do and in particular their benefactors? They might as well just call it the start of the process of going down to 3 regions, because that's where this is going. Finances must be bad!
 
Cant see how seperate relationships is going to work, can someone explain it to me and convince me everyone's going to be happy with it?

If the Scarlets are one of the favoured ones the whole of Wales will be up in armsBig smile
Life is not a rehearsal, make sure you support the Scarlets NOW
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Originally posted by Tim Opolis Tim Opolis wrote:

If the WRU decides to have seperate relationships with the regions, what do they think the region that gets short changed is going to do and in particular their benefactors? They might as well just call it the start of the process of going down to 3 regions, because that's where this is going. Finances must be bad!
 
Cant see how seperate relationships is going to work, can someone explain it to me and convince me everyone's going to be happy with it?
Divide and rule.  At the moment all the regions seem to be pulling in the same direction.  If the WRU offer the carrot of more money to some, they are likely to look after their own short term interests and go for it.  Every region will go with their begging bowl and a nice presentation saying how they desreve a bigger piece of pie and how crap the rest are.
I don't see how going to 3 regions will boost attendances.  Will anyone from Newport go to watch the Blues?  We'd have more luck putting buses on to Llanelli.  The only benefit to 3 regions would be more money from the WRU, but an even narrower support base. 
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given that they are so in awe of the irish way i can see it being like it is there,3 regions scarlets,blues and dragons with the ospreys being like connachtLOL a development region.
30th june 1986- 30th june 2011.25 years roofing,i wouldn't call that dodgy.
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Originally posted by TonduTurk TonduTurk wrote:

Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

Originally posted by TonduTurk TonduTurk wrote:

Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

The WRU do have some history of this. I remember when the Warriors were divvied up, we were the standard bearers in Europe so it was suggested we get last pick of the players. We ended up with just Smiler and Havilli.



i dont remember that, i remember all the players being up for grabs, and we had a settled squad that had just won the league so only needed a few players.


The Warriors players were distributed under a draught system where the most unsuccessful region got first dibbs.

The nearest quote I have is from the BBC at the time which wrote:

"Some 20 players of the 34-man squad were called one-by-one to learn their fate, having heard this week that the WRU plan to disband the regional side.

The distribution will probably be based on a draft system, players agent Adam Palfrey told BBC Wales.

Cardiff Blues are thought likely to get first pick as the least successful side last season."

So the WRU have form for this kind of "weakest needs the most help" ideology.

If I remember rightly, the player we most wanted was Ryan Jones but it was suggested that to allow the Scarlets to grab the best players would only make us stronger at the expense of the other regions.

The other quote which shows huge irony in hindsight is:

"The Ospreys have also offered their assistance and "will move heaven and earth to bring in as much of the Warriors' region within the Ospreys set-up"."

Set the tone for the next 7 years. I love the "offered their assistance" bit!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/3725539.stm



the bit in bold is a statement, and all you've got to back it up is "nearest quote", "probably", "thought likely", "If I remember rightly" and "suggested".


Oh for Christ sake - I made a statement and have done as much as I can to back it up and have come pretty darned close. So many posts on here are just total gossip - at least I've provided some evidence!

OK, I was saying what was being reported at the time and if it eventually didn't end up like that then well, fair cop, but that's what I'd read at the time and have tried to substantiate it as much as possible (and far more than some of the crap written on here).
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Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

Originally posted by TonduTurk TonduTurk wrote:

Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

Originally posted by TonduTurk TonduTurk wrote:

Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

The WRU do have some history of this. I remember when the Warriors were divvied up, we were the standard bearers in Europe so it was suggested we get last pick of the players. We ended up with just Smiler and Havilli.



i dont remember that, i remember all the players being up for grabs, and we had a settled squad that had just won the league so only needed a few players.


The Warriors players were distributed under a draught system where the most unsuccessful region got first dibbs.

The nearest quote I have is from the BBC at the time which wrote:

"Some 20 players of the 34-man squad were called one-by-one to learn their fate, having heard this week that the WRU plan to disband the regional side.

The distribution will probably be based on a draft system, players agent Adam Palfrey told BBC Wales.

Cardiff Blues are thought likely to get first pick as the least successful side last season."

So the WRU have form for this kind of "weakest needs the most help" ideology.

If I remember rightly, the player we most wanted was Ryan Jones but it was suggested that to allow the Scarlets to grab the best players would only make us stronger at the expense of the other regions.

The other quote which shows huge irony in hindsight is:

"The Ospreys have also offered their assistance and "will move heaven and earth to bring in as much of the Warriors' region within the Ospreys set-up"."

Set the tone for the next 7 years. I love the "offered their assistance" bit!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/3725539.stm



the bit in bold is a statement, and all you've got to back it up is "nearest quote", "probably", "thought likely", "If I remember rightly" and "suggested".


Oh for Christ sake - I made a statement and have done as much as I can to back it up and have come pretty darned close. So many posts on here are just total gossip - at least I've provided some evidence!

OK, I was saying what was being reported at the time and if it eventually didn't end up like that then well, fair cop, but that's what I'd read at the time and have tried to substantiate it as much as possible (and far more than some of the crap written on here).
It's not always about where you end up, it's about how you get there.
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Quite simple as far as I'm concerned, the WRU should be encouraging the regions to develop Welsh talent on and off the pitch and rewarding success in that respect, a mistake would be saying if you get a HC quarter final or win the league regardless of the make up of your squad (i.e. NWQ coming out of their ears) then you get a bigger chunk although results must be build into the equation to some degree.
 
Any arguments for what if a Turk is coach, what if players are injured etc. are largely irrelevant to the bigger picture, we can't carry on the way things are.
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Perhaps people just can't afford to go. There is unemployment in the area, where a £20 ticket is a third of the weekly job seekers allowance.

 Rugby is not dying, it’s just the industries!!

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